#523 Uncovering Hidden Millions: Steve & Melissa Fultz on Tech and AI for Family Business Growth

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Mehmet: Hello and welcome back to an episode, episode of the CT O Show with Maad today. I'm very pleased. Joining me, Steve and Minister Fultz. Both, you know, are great guests and I'm happy to have them on, on the show. Maybe the audience will notice that this is the second [00:01:00] episode in a row where I have guests and sitting in the same room together.

Yeah, so we bring, we brought back the old, uh, artifacts that I used to use before, but nevertheless, I'm very excited to speak to Steve and Melissa today the way I love to do it. Steven me says, I keep it to you. Introduce yourself, tell us more about you, your background, and what you are currently up to.

And then we're gonna take the discussion from there. We're gonna talk a lot about, you know, how we can let more people who are maybe not the normal or regular audience, know more about technology, ai, and a lot of of cool stuff. So, Steven mea the floor is yours. 

Steve: That's great. Thank you. We're, we're excited to be here.

I we're. Steven, Melissa Fultz. I'll let her tell you a little bit about her background and what has brought us up to the last couple years about what we're doing. Then I'll jump in. How's that? Sounds good. 

Melissa: So I'm going first? 

Steve: Yeah. 

Melissa: Alright. No, so I, um, I guess I quasi retired from corporate America, uh, about a year and a half ago.

Um, and [00:02:00] we've been, you know, working together from a, you know, kind of consulting standpoint. We both had written books back in 2015, um, and in our own respective industries I was healthcare and I really focused and worked with the large health systems and built partnerships all around automation and medication safety.

So I was very familiar with automating things and technology. And, you know, robotics and how that can impact a business. So, um, that was kind of my corporate America background and it collides right at the intersection of his, so we're, I'm Wall Street. Yeah. Um, I kind of Fortune five companies and, uh, leadership in those companies.

So I'm Wall Street meets Main Street here. 

Steve: Yeah. And so real quick, my, I was born into a family business. My dad had already started doing what he did before I was born, and I'm 58. So he is been doing that about 60 years. We buy and sell, uh, petroleum transport equipment and over the years he bought into a couple other businesses, uh, that repaired.

So it's kind of a vertical market. So [00:03:00] as I was growing up watching him in the business, I kind of went down the, uh, church route. I served local churches, served on staff. On, uh, churches for about 25 years. Ended up on kinda large church, got a PhD in psychology while I was there. Opened up a couple of counseling centers before he got ready to retire.

He said, Hey, would you like to come back and get into the business? And I'm like, that. I've been wanting to get in the business since, you know, I can remember. So in about 2010, I came back in the family business. One thing about technology, I was, I've always considered myself a, a closet tech guy. And, uh, I've realized I couldn't keep up the last several years, but over the years and, and even, um, part of my uniqueness in, in doing church, if you think about it, the church is one of the best marketing.

Um, uh, institutions in the world, but I, I tried to do a lot of marketing stuff to the church, taking it [00:04:00] outside the walls instead of expecting everybody to come inside. So I've always kind of had that want. Tobe, I got my dad online, uh, really in 99, 2000 when websites were just starting out. So we have a lot of, um, Google Grade organic stuff over the years, so.

When she decided to retire, we, we and come back in and help in our family businesses. We started, uh, wanting to help other business owners, uh, who were. What we were seeing, um, what we believed to be, who were chained to their business. You know, we have a lot of friends who started the business for freedom and it really created a prison for them.

Uh, we call it a kind of a velvet handcuffs. And so we've started trying to help people put systems together so they're not, um, chained to the business. They, they have freedom. We call it obsolete by design. They have freedom because of the systems and things [00:05:00] set up, they can actually enjoy life instead of.

You know, dreading every day that they walk into the office so 

Melissa: they can own the business again instead of the business owning them. It gets to that point. 

Mehmet: What a great do. I would say Steve and Melissa, because you know, uh, Steve, you coming from family business, Melissa, you're coming from, you know. Fortune 500 companies.

Now when I was prep, you know, I like to prepare a little bit before I jump into recording. You know, as much as I can. Uh, you know, I learn about what you do, um, and, and the things like you offer and how you help, uh, businesses. One thing you know, stop me when I was reading and especially after, you know, knowing about your backgrounds, is, you know, you talk.

About, you know, hidden revenue opportunities in businesses. So how much, you know, your experience, Steve, and your experience, you know, minister too that the shaped that, you know, okay, now we have this [00:06:00] years of experience, whether in family, business or like with, um, top, uh, companies in the us How, how you, you intersected, you know, these like kind of, uh.

Two experiences, like each one is by itself. You know, you can do a, a, a practice out of it. Um, so how you came up with this, uh, you know, and feel free, you know, I would like to hear both of your, uh, opinions on this. 

Steve: Sure. I'll, uh, I'll jump in. What, what, one thing that we really, and, and I've learned a ton from my father who, you know, born, started at the business, um.

Fault tooth and nail. You know what I mean? Like, uh, he, he's the one that really sacrificed all the time. I kind of had the golden spoon given to me, but my dad was very much a very meticulous on, he actually hand wrote his checks. I've seen him at the end of the year, take days trying to reconcile $7 80 cents, you know, because [00:07:00] he wouldn't, I finally got him on computers in the early two thousands.

But, um, this hidden revenue that you're talking about, we really encourage business owners when you really stop. Um. And I, we use the analogy a lot and I'm gonna, I want her to jump in too. I don't wanna dominate this. We use analogy a lot about, uh, changing the tire as you're going down the road. Mm-hmm.

When you're, when you're riding in the thick of things in a small business, you're wearing a lot of different hats. You don't have a lot of time to step back sometimes and make, uh, decision. I mean, things happen and you have to deal with them the way you know, with, with what you're dealt. But what we have found when we really stop and start looking at expenses.

And, uh, we start looking at what would happen if we, uh, tweak a lead gen here. You know, we're, we're looking at lifetime value of customer, but we're looking at several different concepts, but we have a formula set up that we can uncover at least 50, sometimes a hundred thousand [00:08:00] in a business budget without even increasing any kind of marketing spend.

And it really comes down to. Uh, fine tooth, um, microscopic, I think on, on expenses and then making a couple tweaks on, on the other side. It, it's amazing what the monies are there when you pay attention to it. Yeah, 

Melissa: yeah. Efficiencies that make, I think, um. We, this has kind of found us organically. Um, you know, we live in parallel lives with our brick and mortar businesses mm-hmm.

As to grow and scale those. Um, about a year and a half ago, kind of when I did come back in, we were looking at a pivot then. Do we, um, you know, are we gonna. Wrap this up to sell it. Do we need to scale it? Scale it, um, you know, scale it or sell it? So, um, either way we needed to clean up the foundation and that included some technology and looking at our processes.

And when I came in having the corporate America background and so used to so many just. [00:09:00] Just the foundational structures, um, that we did things, it's so different in a small family business, especially one that's growing. So, um, I've enjoyed coming in and putting, you know, processes in place that I took, you know, for granted that were just everyday processes, um, you know, as we've grown.

So, yeah. One 

Steve: of her first things, she had a problem in her laptop. She said, well, I need to call the it. 

Melissa: I'm like, oh wait. 

Steve: I, I am the IT department. 

Melissa: I never like set up an email. I mean, I was like, 

Steve: just call me. I'll, I'll help you. 

Mehmet: It's 

Melissa: the little things that you just take for granted when you're at work for a big company.

Mehmet: Yeah. I, you know, like I was lucky enough to work with, um. Okay. They were scale ups 'cause they were startups in the US and then they came, you know, to this part of the world where I live. So when we, so I, I get, I get used to the culture of the startups and small business, right? So whenever we hired someone from a big.

You know, name, you know, in the tech, the first thing the guy would ask, Hey, like, uh, who do [00:10:00] I call to do this? I said, no, you don't call someone to do this. You do it by you. Do it by yourself. Thank you. Oh, that's awkward. I said, yeah, like, you know, like here you are, kind of, this is what they used to tell us, especially if in a new organization where you are starting from scratch.

So you wear all the hats. So you are the CEO, you are the CTO, you are the CMO, you are everything. The plumber. Yeah. You mentioned, which is. I like. What about the organic growth? And also Steve, like you, you, you highlighted this as well. Um, I'm a big believer, you know, it, it's in this time like, you know, you need to kind of rely on yourself and, and when you say rely on yourself, I mean like of course you need to do the work so people can notice and then you do great work.

So people will tell other people, Hey, like I met this. You know, folks, and they did a great job. And then you get this, I'm not saying like we shouldn't do [00:11:00] marketing. Yeah. But you know, like focusing on, on the organic growth is, is, is important now. Um, so, so talking about, you know, businesses that you work with, um, when you start to tell them about, you know, utilizing, let's say tech, right?

Yeah. As, as, as one option maybe to uncover these hidden. Uh, revenue streams. So what is the action you see from them? Like, is it like something, oh my God, like, no, this is like, uh, I have to, to hire bunch of technical people to do this. Or maybe they think it's, it's a huge project that they are not ready to do it.

Uh, how do you. Break this kind of stereotype that some business owners they would have that this is not, it's not for me. This, this is not something for me. Uh, and you come in and you show them. No, like it's, it's if we follow like certain workflows, we can achieve the results that, uh, we, we are [00:12:00] trying to do.

Steve: I think you've identified our biggest. Hurdle, both the entry point, but also because it's so diverse depending on that business owner and his or her experience, you know, over the years. But we wrote a book in um, March called Family Business Facelift, and mm-hmm. It's basically a parable. I mean, we use it.

It's a, it's a fictional story about a husband and wife that have 20 something kids. Well, no, wait, they 

Melissa: don't have 20 kids. 

Steve: They have two, two children who are in their twenties. There you go. Yeah. And, uh, they have a retail business, five locations. And we, we create this. Real life pain of waking up at 3:00 AM of oh no, you know, uh, my inventory business owner feels Yeah.

Uh, payroll, you know, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So, but in that book, we put a companion workbook and one of the first things, and the reason we did this, this was us. Mm-hmm. Uh, we, one of our first assessments we asked them to do is called a [00:13:00] business Tech readiness assessment. And I got that. From her and her corporate America.

Like I, I'm the guy that fires and then I'll aim, you know, I'm the entrepreneur that I'm like, whoa, hey, let's do this. Let's do this. She wrote us down and do this the right way. She's like, no, no, no, no. So we're asking a lot more questions and that has been one of the best tools with our customers. They're like, oh my goodness.

And for us, who, I think I'm a tech guy, I realized our technology at our businesses. You know, $10 million, two businesses, that 50 people, my tech is probably 20 years outdated. So our first step was, uh, kind of beefing up our internal, uh, tech to get even ready to start doing some of the system stuff. So.

Your, your question, I think you nailed it. And every person, what we're finding is they don't even wanna look. They think, I don't wanna learn it. I don't wanna know. It's so 

Melissa: overwhelming to them. 

Steve: I wanna put a duct [00:14:00] tape over the check engine light and let's just keep going till it stops, you know? 

Melissa: But 

Steve: 10 so 

Melissa: fast that, I mean, AI's here and as we've had to learn it too, we by no means are experts.

We're just thought leaders. We say we're just a couple steps ahead maybe of. Of our generation trying to learn it. And, um, you know, with our, with our tech readiness assessment, it does kind of identify low hanging fruit, you know, things that we need to clean up first. It really puts it more in a, you know, roadmap, um, to get you where you need to go, depending on what your outcomes, you know, what you're, what you're trying to do.

Are you trying to grow? Are you trying to sell? Are you trying to retire? Um, so there's a lot to do before you can just start throwing stuff at it. 

Steve: Yeah. And well, I don't wanna cut you off if you had a thought there. Well, the next business readiness, and this was all her, and we put it all in the book because they mm-hmm.

We let these characters do it. But, uh, one of the things I thought was brilliant that she came up with is when you think about, [00:15:00] um, older business owners we're, we're in our fifties. I'm closer to the 60 than she is. Um, but still young. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of times they're scared of tech and, um, she cr created an assessment called a, a tech buddy Part Mentor or something.

Yeah. 

Melissa: It's like, um, it's, it's more looking at your entire organization, finding the strengths of those who are stronger in tech and are more comfortable with those that aren't, and pairing them up. So kind of a buddy system, um, but really evaluating your entire team to see where their strengths are.

Before you, you know, set everybody up for failure. 

Steve: Yeah. And that came from her managing a variety of ages from California to New York, to Miami to Seattle and Uhhuh 

Melissa: to 65 years old. Yeah. You know, managing even, you know, five different generations almost. 

Steve: But what we're finding is the older people are connecting with the younger employees because the younger employees [00:16:00] are helping them.

And so it's been a cool thing that now the younger 'cause. You know, I've heard people say, well, Helen's been our ai, you know, she's been here 30 years and she knows everything. It's a person. Yeah. She's just intelligent. We, we changed Helen's name to Google, Google, Helen. But, but, uh, it's been a cool thing for the different ages to respect the other person's, you know, uh, situation we 

Melissa: think of, we think of mentorship as our, you know, the older people mentoring the younger.

Um, but this way it's a kind of a dual older, it's a, you know, mentor up and down in different ages so we can all learn from each other. 

Steve: That's been a benefit we didn't expect. Absolutely. Yeah. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. Have you seen just, you know, it's a question that just popped up in my head. Have you seen like also the older generation, because you mentioned about like how they rely on the younger ones.

I noticed something sometimes they would. Of course, maybe they will not master it. They would not understand it [00:17:00] fully. But what I've noticed, at least, you know, with people that I talk to, they are more eager to adopt the technology than maybe people who are in my age. I'm in my mid forties, for example.

Yeah. And I, you know, I, I see them pushing back, you know, no, no, no. Like, you know, when I talk to people who are like, actually, I say, oh, wow. Like these folks are really, you know, forward thinking. Although like, you know, they know maybe they cannot, uh, operate it themselves, but they say, Hey, like, this is something useful.

Have you seen something similar? 

Melissa: It's a mix. Are you saying like you're seeing that in older generations that they already, they're Yeah. 

Steve: To, yeah. I think what we see is people know that it's here, and what I'm, what we're seeing is a lot of these businesses that have been open 20, 30 years that have been a loyal business, you know, a service-based business.

Uh, they're finding, uh, competitors coming in and automating stuff, and they're losing their people and they're scared to death. So I see part of people saying, I've gotta [00:18:00] figure this out. I see. I do see that, but I don't, I think our age, like I'm not really on social media and I never have, but I've seen my parents.

Um, because of, to connect with the grandkids and kind of know what everybody else is doing. So it could be that that older generation is using it for family. Right. So they're, they're realizing I've gotta embrace it and I might as well apply it to business. 

Melissa: And I, I do think that I have seen where, you know, businesses or individuals or leaders who are datadriven have always been data driven, no matter how they've gotten the data.

It used to be, you know, being Excel spreadsheets, they are more open, you know, to AI and um, you know, but there's a little bit of a danger there too, because if you just are reading blind data and you dunno the story behind it, I've always said. Um, I, I was always look at data of, okay, most people say, here's what this, here's the story data's telling me.

And I look at it and say, what's this data not telling me? I [00:19:00] like to, you know, say, look at it at just a different way. So I think we gotta be careful as we do transition into full AI and data as leaders in older generations, making sure that we really understand, you know, the sources that it's coming from.

So 

Mehmet: great. You know, I, I like, I like this approach. Like, what's, what is that telling us? Like, uh, 'cause ma of the people will, will jump in and start now. One, one thing also, especially for dealing regardless of of the age, but again, because you focus on, on certain generation also as well and businesses that has been there for a long time now.

Yeah. Uh, some frictions I've heard from different people, uh, on the show and outside, of course, that when the business has been running for, I don't know, maybe 20, 25 years, 30 years, and you come and tell these people, Hey, like, you know what? You should modernize little bit your stack. You should do some automation.

You start to see these [00:20:00] pushbacks people telling you, Hey, like, we've been doing this for ages, we don't need to change. And you tell them, Hey, but you know what? Like. Let's say famous maybe, uh, Marissa, you heard a lot like I did in the corporate world, disrupt or be disrupted, and I tell you, Hey man, like no one would care about me.

Like I'm happy doing it this way. Now, I'm sure you faced some resistance similar to those ones. So what are like some of the. Examples, maybe you give, uh, people you talk to, so you convince them that you should actually modernize and rely on technology, automation, ai, and, and different things. 

Melissa: Well, this kind of goes back to our approach being different.

I, I tend to put things in buckets and I look at almost four different kinds of clients that we would work with. Um, well, four different kinds of clients that are out there. Um, and they're in, you know, there's in growth mode, those that are really growing and they know they need something. There's those that have maybe even grown too much or [00:21:00] they're in trouble.

So there is a need and there's a compelling event for those two especially. So growth mode and trouble mode. Um, there's others that are kind of even keel or maybe overconfident. Those two, they're probably not ready yet. Something's gotta happen. Um, there almost has to be some kind of compelling event or the next generation coming up and saying.

Hey, it's time. So we really look for those that are in growth mode or we hate trouble mode. We hope that it never gets there. But those are the two that are, they know they need something and that's half the battle. It's just helping them figure out now what it is they need. 

Steve: Yeah, and I think us living it in our own situation makes us a lot more, uh, sympathetic to, to our clients because.

You know, I can remember when dad retired and I call it, uh, sitting in dad's chair. I can remember walking in the office. He's not here. I sit there and it's like, oh, no. You know what if I make a wrong move and [00:22:00] lose what he's built, and what if I do this wrong? And so for six months, I just smiled and nodded and met people.

I mean, I knew them, but I just, I was afraid to make a decision. We live it, even with what we're doing, people are like, now why are we doing this? And what, why are we quitting what we're doing now? And all we're trying to do, and we're not of the notion, I do know that AI will replace some jobs. Uh, I think that's a given, but we're not a proponent of that.

I think we want to help employees learn how to, and business owners learn how to, um, orchestrate ai, you know, be a conductor. That can help several things where it frees them up to be with customers, which is, 

Melissa: that's what people do best. 

Steve: It's what it, yeah, it's what it's about that those relationships. So, 

Mehmet: great.

Now we talked about AI a lot, uh, Steve, Melissa, and you know, I'm sure also you've seen this, when, when nowadays we [00:23:00] say the word ai, people expectations are so high and people, they think it's a magic pill that will solve everything. So between. Reality. Reality and the promises of what people might be seeing or, you know, hearing from other people.

How do you set the expectation, right? Like, because you know, sometimes, and I like your mentioning Steve, multiple times automation, because this is what I tell people Yes. Like. You. You don't just get a technology for the sake of getting the technology. You need to just see what's not working today and what's a potential, any technology that you can put in to make it better.

So yeah. Setting the expectation. And, you know, people are eager to use ai. Some people, you know, and we've seen some, you know, as the Gen Zs, they call them the memes, right? And all these funny cartoons that we see here and there where the SEOs, what do you want? They say, we want ai. When do you want it? We want it today.

Uh, how, where do you want to start? We [00:24:00] don't know. We just want ai. So how to set expectations in the right way.

Melissa: Oh, 

Steve: well, I, I, I will tell you, and, and we're very clear, we don't use AI as a hat, that we pull a bunny out of, you know, and we're not a, don't use, don't use it as a Xerox machine to throw out a job description or something like that, like. I think a lot of people are using it for that transactional, what we're trying to help business owners do is data dump.

Like, 'cause I know my dad was the business, my dad had 55, 60 years of the business. Nothing on paper, you know? So I had to sit there and listen to him for four years to learn about the business. So what we're trying to do is get. Business operations, procedures. Yeah. That's the 

Melissa: first big step. Really? Yeah.

And that's, 

Steve: we're trying to data dump to [00:25:00] say, because AI and, and all the research, it's about half ripe and half wrong. I, I, if people agree, it's not like it's some magic pill, but when we're, what we're trying to do is say, AI can be a board of directors, it can be your, uh, board of advisors. It, it, it lit. It never gets sick.

It never calls in, you know, it's not got sick children, you know, it's not in a fuss with somebody down the next hall, you know, so I, and 

Melissa: I think most are more curious about AI and how it can impact their business more so than grabbing it by the horns and having, having a bunch of expectations. I think we see more so than not, it's people are curious.

Steve: Yeah. 

Melissa: Um, so we encourage people just to start playing with it, to start getting to know it. There's an art to it in the Art of Prompts, another book that we're working on. And it is the art, the a RT and artificial intelligence, um, because it's. There is an art to the prompts in how you use it. So 

Steve: yeah, and I think our approach is a lot more, um, asking questions like we [00:26:00] ask a ton of questions, so the business owner, you know, he or she can start answering and, and in, in coming up with those answers, he or she or solving his or her problem, you know what I mean?

That's, 

Melissa: it's a psychology to it. Yeah. Yeah. 

Steve: So we're, we're a lot about, um. A whole lot more of gathering because here AI means nothing if it's not gonna solve a problem. Absolutely. Like we have to look at a problem and that that business is having and saying, and then when they see it's the flywheel effect when they see this work and they say, well, let's try this.

And then they see, and then that's if we can't get a small win early, it's a uphill battle with an older business owner who doesn't like technology anyway. 

Mehmet: Love that. Exactly. So we, we need to start from somewhere. How much time you spend. I'm not sure, like, is it you Steve, or you Marissa. How much time you spend, you know, in addition to, to talk to customers and, you know, show them their journey, um, in coaching, [00:27:00] right?

Because I think, you know, any transformation you do for the business and, you know, technical transformation, digital transformation, whatever, AI transformation, whatever people want to call it nowadays. Um. You know, the coaching part and changing mindsets. Yeah. How much time, how much does that take times from you?

Melissa: This is what we're, well, this is what we're excited about too, and this is where it is growing again organically, and this is what we're finding. As, you know, married business owners tend to are finding us, but creating a community, you know, to us there's so much power in group coaching. We learn from each other, our peers.

We're gonna learn more from our peers than somebody telling us what to do. So, you know, find, we are creating that community, you know. Um, you can find us on school. We've got a, we've started it there in school. 

Steve: Yeah. We've got a family business forum on, on school that's a free platform that we're connecting business owners there.

Uh, we have hopes and plans to do some, you know, more. Not [00:28:00] a, I don't think people want another mastermind, but I do think they want another fun time with people that they can learn from and network with. Yeah, so we're doing a couple things in the Caribbean in the spring and the fall. You come down, we'll.

Talk business in the morning and hang out in the afternoons kind of thing. Um, but what I, I tell you, you brought up something we don't want to get to where we're trading time for money as a PhD psychologist, you know, that's what I did. So, uh, we spent about a year being on the phone, 20. 30 times a week with people.

And I'm like, I, that's another job. Learned a lot. We learned a lot. We don't want that either. No. So we wanna help people, but we would like to have the content where they can pull it out themselves, you know? 

Melissa: And we are trying to do things that are, you know, it's the old philosophy of give a man a fish, feed 'em for their day, teach man to fish, feed 'em for a lifetime.

So a lot of the things that we're doing in the courses that we're doing are self-paced. Self-guided, like our book that is the Family Business Facelift. Um, it has a companion workbook with all of the assessments that as you go [00:29:00] through the book and you follow that couple, go through the tools that they, they were provided.

That's what the workbook is. It's the tools in the same order that you can do on your own business and see what works for you. So we're trying to really do that. Self-guided and self-paced. Um, you know, teach them how to fish. 

Steve: Well, yeah, we're modeling what some people can do, you know, here's how we're doing it.

And a lot of people are trying to do some of the similar stuff we're doing and 

Melissa: then get everybody together and say, Hey, how did it work? What did you all do? That's what I can't wait for. That's what's next. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. You know, I, I like this and I can't agree more about, you know, the. When you get people together, this is when the magic happens.

Uh, yeah. I've seen, I've seen it beforehand. You know, of course people would be like little bit hesitant before, uh, sometimes, oh, there might be someone who is a competitor there. I don't, I don't want to share much, but once people, they come together and they start to talk to each others, and of course like.

With, with, with someone like yourself, [00:30:00] you know, like, uh, having these, uh, years of experience, I, I think, you know, the discussion should not be missed, I would say, uh, because you, you get like great minds in the same room and then yeah, people start to, to brainstorm new ideas. Even now, if, if I want to take.

You know, I, I like stories and I like, you know, kind of what we call user experience, right? So if I come to you today, right, as, as a business owner, and, you know, I want to start the journey. So, so how does it look like, like, um, and when I would expect to see the first outcomes, um, after, you know, uh, doing the, the, the work with you.

Steve: Yeah, we, we spend the first, I would say, um, three sessions, gathering information like, so we will talk a lot and ask for some things. Uh, and we're talking about very general, so, but there's a lot of, on the front [00:31:00] end, I would say. And, and those three sessions, we really try to drill down into what is the problem, like what has put this person in this pain?

Point for this today. Mm-hmm. And that's kinda where we is the first step mm-hmm. That we do Then, uh, because you know, a lot of times I used to say we humans are a lot like onions. You know, we have a lot of layers and we make people cry. So a lot of times what they come to us with is maybe easier to talk about, but in those three times, we're giving them things to think about in between.

So normally what they first present with is different on the third time, but our goal is real quickly to get them some wins, uh, early. And the, uh, we've not really seen timelines. It's been hard because some, some are really easy, you know, that you can do. Uh, others are a little more complex. So we, we just spend a lot of time [00:32:00] drilling down to find out.

What is really going on that they need with at that time? 

Melissa: Well, and even if we're gonna take them on a journey, the customer journey and the roadmap, you think of anytime you travel and you've got your GPS and you put in your coordinates of where you're going, well, you have to know where you are before you know how to get there.

So really making sure that we understand current state where they are. All their current pain points and then making sure that they're on the same page of where they wanna go, you know, is, is the couple, um, you know, are they on the same page about the business and the timing and all that. So there a little bit of that.

We don't do marriage counseling. It can get, can refer. Um, you know, but, but those are some hard conversations that are delicate to have 

Mehmet: and I think, Marissa, you mentioned something few minutes ago about the, the data and, you know, tracking the, the progress over there. So, uh, you know, because if we don't measure things we.

Can like easily, [00:33:00] uh, you know, start to say, oh, like, I'm not seeing any progress, or, uh, why, why still my sales are like, uh, you know, stuck on the same levels as before. Maybe they are declining. So, so measuring data, I believe also is, is one of the, uh, main methodologies that need to be, to be done during any, any transformation, uh, process Now.

One, one thing, you know, also, I like to, to hear from you any outstanding use case that you can give us. Because, you know, again, when, when we give people examples, they might, you know, get it even in a better way. And maybe minister, you know, it's from, from the corporate world. We used to do these success stories and use cases is so people can, can, can get it.

I, I would love to hear if you have any you can share. No, 

Steve: I think we could probably tell 'em about, um. I'm gonna use the initials. Mh, we don't have permission to say this, to say their 

Melissa: name. Yeah, but that's a good one. Yeah. 

Steve: Yeah. We have worked [00:34:00] with a, um, and recent, recently she just sent a thank you another, but, um, probably a couple years maybe.

Mm-hmm. We've worked with a, a person, uh, business owner, female. Her husband's kind of involved in the business. She had bought out her father's business and it was kind of struggling but going, but her passion was in another area. Mm-hmm. And, uh, we worked with her for a year and a half to two years, and she has just, uh, blossomed.

The, the passion project that she went with, she's got, her business is still running, which is kind of our obsolete by design. Mm-hmm. Uh, but she has, um, catapulted into her passion and, um. Is loving it. So that, that's one thing 

Melissa: we did. I mean, we helped her scale her current business so that she could, and, and part of, again, that interview process of us drilling down and assessing her end goal and what she wanted, you know, her [00:35:00] destination was something completely out of her industry she wanted to do.

It was, you know, just, yeah, it was fascinating to see and to understand what her personal whims were. So we got her office kind of running and automating itself, um, so that she could free, she could go do what her passion was. 

Steve: Yeah. So she's, and the reason it's on Tip of the tongue, couple days ago, I guess we got an email or a text.

Thank you. Something. But, um, 

Mehmet: great. 

Steve: That's, that would be a, a more recent one. 

Mehmet: No, I, I love, I love these stories and, you know, I, I, something I wanted to say before, but just because I remembered now your approach of, you know, having these sessions asking questions, I think this is by itself is the differentiation because everyone else, I mean, when I may, when I say everyone, the majority would go start pitching solutions and products.

Um. 

Steve: You're not gonna believe this, but we also don't have a fee structure. Like we don't, I'm not that guy. I've had so many things that I [00:36:00] pay 7,000, 10,000, 12,000, whatever. I, I want to hear three. I wanna really hear the problem. And then we're gonna say, and I show them, what's it gonna cost you to not solve this problem?

Mm-hmm. And then I look at, because I'm not trading time for money, I, I mean, I don't want another job. I want to help somebody. Right down the road, so it's gonna cost them. And so I don't even, people say how much you cost. I say a lot. I mean it, it 

Melissa: depends. Yeah. That's always the answer. It depends. Yeah. 

Steve: No, this is side or the high side.

The high side. Because we get results. I mean, I ab absolutely. You're not trying to be a cocky, arrogant, it's just. If you don't, you're gonna be here another year. What's it cost you to not solve this problem? Yeah, 

Mehmet: I, I, I agree. You know, 1000%. I'm exaggerating a little bit because the other day, you know, sometimes, uh, I share, you know, from time, time some my own views on the AI use cases in business and so on.

So someone [00:37:00] noticed, um, they gave me a call. And they said, Hey, like, it looks like you understand AI business, the ai, and how it can be used in the business. So, uh, how much do you charge? I said, hold on. It's not the way I do it. Right? And then I, and I said, okay, what do you do? I said, I need to understand first, like, it, it was like a kind of a, uh, company that deals with a lot of.

Other companies. So they want to add the AI part. And, you know, to cut the story short, uh, they said, uh, okay, so what are your offerings? I said, look, I can't just tell you anything. Now, I'm not into the, what we call them, the box movers, right? And, and these kinds of things. I said, you know, I need to understand what we are talking about.

I said, you know what, guess maybe you would not believe. I said, guess what? Some business, they don't need ai, like I said. Oh, how come? I said, yeah, because you know, maybe the way the business is run, they don't need ai. They just need maybe to [00:38:00] modernize some of the stuff that they do. Maybe adopt maybe an Asana project management or something like this.

They don't need ai. I said, oh wow. Like every single person we talk to, like they will start to get us these 10,000, 20,000, $30,000. I said, no, I'm not into this business because, you know, like, uh, you know, I, I want also to be selective because if the customer doesn't understand that they have a pain point they need to solve, there is no point of me going and wasting my time to your point.

So just, it's something, you know, which it came on time. 'cause this happened like, just like two weeks ago. So it was good. Uh, good timing now. One thing I'm, I'm curious a little bit about regarding the verticals or the sectors, whatever you want to call them. Is there a common thing that is fixed among any type of business?

Or is it like more something that we need to customize? I mean, you need to customize when it comes to the way you do this. So let's say, is it the same [00:39:00] thing if it's a retail business rather than, I don't know, maybe a insurance business or. There is, you know, some customization that you need also to work on with these business owners.

Steve: Y you know, uh, we're in a, um. What I would call antiquated industry in the repair services. You know, technology's normally behind. So, um, uh, I would have to say yes there, there, it's not a cookie size per industry, and I know there are some industries that may be, uh, heavier on the phone side. Some are heavier on the email side, you know, so when you look at from the intake to the processing, the operations, there are some.

Uh, variations that have to be customized, that thing. 

Melissa: Yeah. But I think there's basic business principles, and this is something coming in from, for me, coming in from the corporate world and seeing my really, my first time in the small business and family business and [00:40:00] entrepreneur world, even though I think I've realized I was always an entrepreneur, even in my organizations.

'cause I always was that maverick and thought leader and challenge the status quo. So I, I've always kind of been. One of those. But there, you know, just basic business principles that I think as businesses are growing, depending on where they are in their journey, um, are they just starting up? Which usually, you know, we're working with older businesses and they're not, they're are business, you know, they're looking at retirement.

So there is usually a compelling something that this age, right. Is looking at. So there's a common denominator there. I can't really pinpoint it, but that's a good, that's gonna make me think 

Steve: Yeah, 

Melissa: because there are some common denominators. 

Mehmet: Makes sense a lot to me. Makes sense a lot to me. And uh, you know, I like when you said this also about the, you know, you don't need to have a startup to be an entrepreneur.

And I, you know, when people tell me like, do you see yourself as an entrepreneur? I said, I spend. [00:41:00] Plenty of time in, in corporate, but I consider myself an entrepreneur because the first thing, whenever I go to a place, why you're doing it this way. Yeah. Explain to me why, why you didn't try to make it in a faster way or cheaper way, or, you know, uh, easy way.

Uh, so I, I like this approach also as well. Now, moving forward a little bit then if, if we want to. You know, have no one have crystal balls. I'm aware of this, but, uh, what do you expect, like some other shifts that not only ai, AI automation, there's plenty of other emerging technologies out there would have effect on the business, on business models.

Like, uh, uh, do, do you see like, uh, more opportunities to come or, because, you know, some people they are starting to talk about how even some business might disappear. You know, we hear some. You know, technology leaders talking about the one person, uh, unicorn companies. What's the point on this? 

Melissa: [00:42:00] I do think COVID changed everything for everyone, and this is global.

Um, and I know that's when we really started talking about, you know, shifting what our long-term goals were. Let's speed this retirement thing up. So, um, I, I do think, um, look at retail as an example. We were just walking through our, the mall here in town, which we never do. I, he has to drive me to the mall.

I'm not a normal woman 'cause I hate to shop. He makes me shop and fix auto. Best. Um, lucky you 

Mehmet: Steve. 

Steve: He loves it. I bought that shirt. He did. He 

Melissa: took out the short. He, he, 

Steve: I have two daughters. She has three boys. Have three boys. That was a great, 

Melissa: I was such a boy mom. He's a great girl, dad. But, um, but look at retail.

Even. We were walking through the mall and we cannot believe how different retail has looks. Even five years ago. They may have them all was just empty. Um, so I, you know, I think things are going faster. Um, I think because of AI and because of even just technology, we're a global community anymore, [00:43:00] um, you know, it's, I just think it's shifting faster than we can even imagine.

And it's hard. That's why it's hard for our generation to keep up. The younger ones they're used to. I think this technology changed so fast 

Steve: and I, I, I guess, um, she's always said since this came out, we, we embraced, we got on the train in November of 22 when it came out. I mean, I was like, this is unbelievable.

But, uh, she always said, what's the source of truth? You know, this is gonna come down to. Yeah, how are we gonna know? And um, I don't know. There's more unknowns than not. Um, but I do think I got an email the other day from somebody at the bottom. It had a thumbprint and it said, made 100% by human automation, which I thought was pretty cool that we may see a swing to that human connection because we're gonna see so much that you know what's real and what's not out there.

So, 

Mehmet: I don't know. Ah. Uh, you know, a, a fictional question, are we going to [00:44:00] see businesses run completely by machines? 

Melissa: I don't think they ev I think there's always gotta be human connection with humans, dealing with humans. Um, 

Steve: I, I heard a thought leader that I very much respect said because he knows I'm in the repair business now.

I have, um, I don't know, there's about 50 employees, but about thir, 30 of 'em are technicians and I can't imagine. Doing the work we do without a human there, even directing. But that thought leader said in a year or two, you will have a robot that can do what that human can do to repair that trailer. And it'd probably be about as cost effective as that employee.

And I was like, wow, I still think you're gonna have to have employees that, you know, coordinate conduct. But I do think it's closer than we think. 

Melissa: Yeah, I've seen it in healthcare. What I, what I did for 20 years and sold robotics into pharmacies. It, it was completely [00:45:00] an autonomous robot that picked patient meds.

It was 99.9999% accurate, and it really did. Allow, you know, those clinicians that freed up their time to be by the patient bedside and the outcomes were through the roof for those that had a nurse, you know, that was right by their side, or there was care coordination at discharge because they were freed up to do those things.

That cl that, you know, clinical outcomes are better. 

Mehmet: Yeah. I have a theory to your points, both of you, Steve and Melissa, that businesses who would keep humans will have this mode, will, will have this differentiation that, hey, like we have people who really have the human empathy. They have, you know, the care.

And that's why every single book I, I try to put my hands on and read or any article from thought leaders. So always we see everything that. You know, have the human interaction. It's not because it's safe or not safe against ai, because us as humans, we will not adopt to a machine, especially, for example, [00:46:00] healthcare.

Uh, like taking care of the, of the elderies, you know, like, uh, uh, and Steve, you come from, from that background in psychology, like I would not imagine myself, you know, going that, 

Steve: yeah. To a robot. Yeah, 

Mehmet: yeah, yeah. And the robot sent me like, Hey, I can, I can customize this in this way if you want. Like, that will make, this will make no sense, right?

So, uh, so this is why I believe, you know, the human interaction, and this is, you know, people ask one, one of my guests, of course, she was joking and she said like, Hey babe, you know what, like maybe in a couple of years, maybe you will have your AI avatars doing these, uh uh. Podcast episode. I said no. I would rather, you know, finish, put a lost dot line and say, I'm not doing a podcast anymore because I want to keep, you know, the main thing which I enjoy doing is talking to people like genuine people.

Uh, sometimes by the way we agree, sometimes we disagree. I said, but this is the whole thing is about. Yeah. [00:47:00] So, so to talk to people know new, uh, you know, kind of, of thoughts that these people have new experiences. And this is why, you know, I'm telling people like, if you keep the human touch, you're gonna win.

And we see it actually, I'm, I'm sure in the states is the same when all the mainly telco operators, they try to put their call centers with automated voice. Uh, IVR, they used to call them people and banks, people start to complain. Please give me a human, I want to speak a human being. Yeah. Customer service.

Steve: Customer service. Yeah. 

Mehmet: Oh my God. Yeah. And you know, like funny enough, you know, some of the banks that they, this did this, uh, in the United Arab s they were like saying like, yeah, we are the pioneer banks who brought technology that can answer your questions. And, you know, it can't answer simple things, even.

It can't detect the voice in the right way. So, but nevertheless, uh, Steve and minister, really I'm, you know, I enjoyed the discussion. Yeah. Uh, couple of last things. Steve. You mentioned the book where we can [00:48:00] find it. 

Steve: Yeah, it, uh, on Amazon, we, it's called Family Business Facelift, and there's a companion workbook.

You can do the Kindle or the print. And, um, those two are there. Uh, you can also, we're linked in, we're working on, uh, uh, our, our company's the folks group. Uh, that website's not up, but we have. Uh, YouTube, LinkedIn, all those places. Instagram. Yep. Saw that she does all that. 

Mehmet: Good. Cool. Any final thoughts? Any final thing you want to say before I leave you?

And of course, thank you for mentioning where we can find you, uh, uh, any, any call to action you want to share with the audience today? 

Steve: No, we, we really enjoyed, uh, talking with you. I love your, your smile as infectious. Thank you. And your laugh. Um, I, I think we all. Uh, are better learning this together than apart.

So we enjoy these kind of things. So we'll, we'll be following you. Thank you. We're following you though [00:49:00] too. 

Melissa: No, we, our motto is, um, do the right thing and be kind. So that's our be the right thing 

Mehmet: and be kind. It's the, it's the, it's, it's an advice and a great motto also as well. So, um, you know, I can't thank you enough, you both for being, you know, my guest today.

Uh, maybe people, they don't believe it, but really every time I speak to any of my guests, I learn a lot, you know, because there are always things to learn, new experiences. So I enjoyed the conversation with you today. And for the audience, you can find the links that Steve just mentioned in the show notes.

Um, you know, if you are listening on your favorite podcasting app, you'll find them in the show notes. If you're watching this on YouTube, you'll find them in description, and this is how I end my episodes. This is for the audience. If you just discovered this podcast by luck, thank you for passing by. I hope you enjoyed.

If you did, so give me a small favor, subscribe, share it with your friends and colleagues. As you can see, we are trying to reach as much people as possible in different topics so we can. [00:50:00] Again, as much as possible, cover it all, and if you are one of the people who you know, keep coming back, send me their messages, send me their feedback, send me their compliments.

Thank you very, very, very much for doing so. Thank you for lifting the podcast. In this year, 2025, all the time to the top 200 charts on the Apple Podcast in different countries. Of course, I'm trying to push some countries because I never saw them. US is one of them. But thank you for all my audience, wherever you are, the uk, Germany, Spain, Australia, New Zealand, even Bermuda.

I don't know who's listening to me in Bermuda, but I figured out that we were in the top 10 actually there. So thank you very much and um, as I say, always stay tuned for a new episode very soon. Thank you. Bye-bye. 

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